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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/18/2010 :  10:44:29 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by AJMav

Yes, but according to Mike, you have to pay $350 in gas, plus pack mule rental just to get there.





It will probably also cost a chunk of change for people from Omaha and Millard to hire a Sherpa to guide them to the Sarpy ballpark through that rugged terrain. It's certainly not a voyage that one would make without a guide.

As to your comment on concessions, you're preaching to the choir with me. I totally understand where they are coming from. Also, think about the arena signage. I worked at the Qwest Center for a long time. My information is from 8 months ago. So, unless something has changed with their deal, I know that UNO has no control over the arena ribbon panels. They see not one cent from the advertising that the building runs on those boards. The only thing they can put on those boards is pump up animations. The only signage they get in the arena is the center hung matrix board, and even that they share 50/50 with the building. They do control the dashers, I believe, but don't quote me on that one. That was off my radar. And, they could bring signs onto the arena floor. That was it.

when you really look at the total picture, you see how this was a better option for the royals, and their fans. It's a better deal for everyone except for Omaha on a copetition standpoint for their new ballpark.
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West O Mike
All-Star Mav

Christmas Island
5308 Posts

Posted - 08/18/2010 :  12:28:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nousefouraname


when you really look at the total picture, you see how this was a better option for the royals, and their fans. It's a better deal for everyone except for Omaha on a copetition standpoint for their new ballpark.


What about the taxpayers of Sarpy County? Has Sarpy County ever said how they are going to pay for the ballpark?

(crickets chirping)

And yes, I know the Royals are paying for about 1/4 of the ball park. I'm asking about the rest of costs, which as I understand it, run about $1.5 million a year in bond payments.

Blog: http://huskermike.blogspot.com
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/18/2010 :  12:33:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by West O Mike

quote:
Originally posted by nousefouraname


when you really look at the total picture, you see how this was a better option for the royals, and their fans. It's a better deal for everyone except for Omaha on a copetition standpoint for their new ballpark.


What about the taxpayers of Sarpy County? Has Sarpy County ever said how they are going to pay for the ballpark?

(crickets chirping)

And yes, I know the Royals are paying for about 1/4 of the ball park. I'm asking about the rest of costs, which as I understand it, run about $1.5 million a year in bond payments.

Blog: http://huskermike.blogspot.com



you have to spend money to make money. Sarpy has always been the little brother to omaha. They are now being proactive trying to bring attractions, entertainment, & businesses to the area to spur even more population growth to that area.

In terms of pure bottom line dollars, it might cost the taxpayers money. I have no problem with that myself as I like baseball and will use the stadium. i pay taxes on lots of things I don't use. As long as it's not a total failure and the people of Sarpy end up on the hook for a ton of money, it'll be ok.

The only way Sarpy loses in this is if no development occurs because of this, no businesses come there, and the Royals consider it a failure and leave. Other than that, I think it stands a very strong chance at being a great investment for Sarpy, Papillion, and its residents.
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/18/2010 :  4:06:54 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think long term this will be a win for Sarpy. I know that I'll be headed to Sarpy far more than I did in the past. If the Royals had left town I probably would have made a few more trips to KC or Des Moines. I would not have gone to see and Indy league team DT if that was the option if the Royals had moved to Sugarland. I think that area on 370 would have developed with or without the Royals but the ballpark might attract better and more regional type of attractions than it would have without the ballpark anchoring the area.

That's definitely one of the hot growth areas of the metro.

Greg
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/18/2010 :  4:41:50 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Greg: I've lived in Sarpy for most of my life. I remember the days when the only option for shopping and dining in pretty much all of Sarpy consisted of the Southroads and adjacent area. For years, even decent shopping required a 15 minute trek to Omaha. So, I'm excited and floored that we now have top flight attractions like minor league baseball, shopping centers, and restaurants minutes from my house.

It's a nice ego boost for any community and can only help to draw new residents and businesses.
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AJMav
Minister of Anger

Iran
4503 Posts

Posted - 08/19/2010 :  08:42:23 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think the primary disconnect to Mr. Mike's question is this: Sarpy County isn't as broke like Omaha.

That's somewhat key here.
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/19/2010 :  10:20:13 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
it really should be obvious. It's like Mike said, Omaha doesn't need the Royals. I think he's probably right on that. Sarpy, on the other hand, can carve out a niche with them drawing 5k a night and use it to spur future financial growth in the area. It's pretty obvious to me. If Sarpy can keep them here and snipe a few bucks away from Omaha in terms of entertainment and tax dollars, more power to them.
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AJMav
Minister of Anger

Iran
4503 Posts

Posted - 08/19/2010 :  11:39:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Omaha doesn't need the Royals per Mike...but a 150 million dollar stadium can sit dark for 50 (OK, 46) weeks out of the year?

That makes sense.

Maybe they don't need "The Royals"..but they need somebody. (Somebody other than Creighton that is)
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/19/2010 :  12:07:26 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
well, i'll take them at face value...for now. omaha claims that the stadium can make a profit with or without a tenant. if that's true, so be it. it's not the highest use of that facility to have it dark all that time, but if it pays for itself without a tenant, that's their business. If it proves incorrect and they come to the taxpayers with hat in hands asking them to pick up a huge chunk of change for a white elephant that sits empty for most of the year, they'll have lots of splainin to do. I hope they all get voted out at that point.

same goes for sarpy. if this ballpark does what it claims and spurs economic and population growth in sarpy, i have no problem with it even if my taxes go up incrementally because of it. Like i said, my tax dollars pay for lots of things I don't use or want. However, if Sarpy turns out to be a huge tax burden on the people, then joni jones and the sarpy board will have lots of splainin to do.

How much tax burden is too much? I haven't defined that. However, if my property taxes go up $40 a year over the ballpark, you won't find me crying. If it goes up several hundred, they may have an angry citizen on their hands.

None of these things will be determined for quite a while. In the meantime, I see no reason to do anything other than take it at face value and let it play out. Too much earth has been moved to go back on either project. No point in being negative.
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West O Mike
All-Star Mav

Christmas Island
5308 Posts

Posted - 08/19/2010 :  12:44:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by AJMav

Omaha doesn't need the Royals per Mike...but a 150 million dollar stadium can sit dark for 50 (OK, 46) weeks out of the year?

That makes sense.

Maybe they don't need "The Royals"..but they need somebody. (Somebody other than Creighton that is)


When that stadium draws about 10,000 people from out of town for two solid weeks, then yes, it makes sense to build that new stadium.

How many cities build NFL stadiums that sit empty 350 days a year?

It's not a question of how many days it sits empty, but rather what it brings to the area.

As for Sarpy County, they held the groundbreaking one year ago out at BFE. What else is under construction out at 126th & 370? Heck, what else has even been announced?

Blog: http://huskermike.blogspot.com
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/19/2010 :  12:48:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
that's a pitiful argument, mike, even for you. I know you are unwilling to hire a sherpa and venture out to "BFE"; however, I think if you happened to drive by it, you'd realize that it's a massive construction site right now. Nothing else is going to open there until the ballpark is completed. period. It might even take a couple of years with the economy right now. It will happen though.

of course, we all know you know that. You're just trying to be difficult and oppositional. It's just you being you.

at this point you're not even trying to debate this logically or rationally. You're just throwing garbage at the wall hoping that something sticks in an attempt to win an argument that you're losing badly.
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  08:30:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Let's hope they force MECA to make these changes.

http://www.omaha.com/article/20100820/NEWS01/708209889/2#look-of-ballpark-fan-area-criticized
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  10:34:30 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
that article seems like much ado about nothing to me. Honestly, it's a dual use arean. seems like the planning board is trying to flex its muscles. qwest center needs all the parking it can get and forcing them to use painted bricks as parking stalls will cost the city more money it doesn't have.
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buetane
All-Star Mav

Iceland
2568 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  10:45:38 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nousefouraname

You're just trying to be difficult and oppositional. It's just you being you.



There's one poster on here that does this. And it's not WestO.

I see logic in his argument and this is an argument I don't think that is to be won or lost. As with many discussions on here, they are just that, discussions. Not a contest where a winner is crowned.

I may agree with one person more so than the other but it's hard to fault Omaha or Sarpy or the Royals for doing what they've done.
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  10:49:56 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by buetane

quote:
Originally posted by nousefouraname

You're just trying to be difficult and oppositional. It's just you being you.



There's one poster on here that does this. And it's not WestO.

I see logic in his argument and this is an argument I don't think that is to be won or lost. As with many discussions on here, they are just that, discussions. Not a contest where a winner is crowned.

I may agree with one person more so than the other but it's hard to fault Omaha or Sarpy or the Royals for doing what they've done.



are you trying to say I'm being difficult and oppositional?

I agree with you buetane and I have no problem with you. I've had some problems with Mike but it's more for his completely venomous attitude towards "BFE" and the fact that i feel he's changed his story a few times. He's the one that started it downhill by calling me an idiot. i reacted in kind, but he took it there first.

i'm currently trying to be positive on both stadiums. I was previously against the omaha stadium and still have my issues with it, but I'm trying to be a cheerleader now because there's no stopping it. Omaha is broke, but it's happening either way.
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  10:51:33 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think it's still early in the process to worry about the development to follow the Royals. That area was going to develop either way hopefully though they get better development than what's going up across I-80 (WalMart) from the stadium.

Greg
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  10:52:56 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
In yesterday's pro baseball chat on Omaha.com Rob White had some very nice things to stadium on the quality of the stadium being built. Sounds like it will definitely hold it's own in the PCL. It will be small but that definitely means no bad seats as near as I can tell.

Greg

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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  11:00:54 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Greg S

In yesterday's pro baseball chat on Omaha.com Rob White had some very nice things to stadium on the quality of the stadium being built. Sounds like it will definitely hold it's own in the PCL. It will be small but that definitely means no bad seats as near as I can tell.

Greg





didn't catch that. i will check that out. thanks!
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buetane
All-Star Mav

Iceland
2568 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2010 :  11:34:46 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nousefouraname


are you trying to say I'm being difficult and oppositional?



No, it's not you either. Everybody has had their moments of being difficult and my obligatory disclaimer requires that I say I understand that is a very broad generalization.

WestO's venoumous attitude towards BFE could probably be matched by several people's similar attitudes towards the downtown stadium. I'm not necessarily for the downtown stadium either, but I quickly became for it when I realized we wouldn't have the CWS without it. But I enjoy the CWS. Some don't, therefore their attitudes are different. And like you say, it's not us that decides where our tax money goes and sometimes it's for things that we don't use and sometimes it is.
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Bigredmed
Senior Mav

1574 Posts

Posted - 08/25/2010 :  10:39:57 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Admin, is it time to lock this topic?
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AJMav
Minister of Anger

Iran
4503 Posts

Posted - 08/25/2010 :  10:44:34 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Bigredmed

Admin, is it time to lock this topic?



Why?

It's the single most polorizing topic in modern history of this town...especially in terms of sports.

People are so freaking sensative around here. Must be the participant ribbon society we've created over the past few decades. Lame.
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AJMav
Minister of Anger

Iran
4503 Posts

Posted - 08/25/2010 :  10:47:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
PS - Greg, good to hear that Rob said that. I trust his judgement as he's been involved with minor league baseball in this town for a long time. I hope he's right and will be happy to say I was wrong if it comes down to it.

(Knowing that if I say I'm wrong..that makes Roger more wrong)

Get it?
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/25/2010 :  2:27:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
don't lock it. that would be dumb.
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/26/2010 :  08:47:53 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yeah this is a great one that could go a while with the stadiums not opening until next Spring. I think everyone here has enjoyed the debate, I know I have.

Greg

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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/26/2010 :  09:33:53 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
it is a really good debate and as others have said there's no really right or wrong answer even when it gets heated.
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/26/2010 :  3:27:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
very interesting to read in the owh chat that 76% of their submissions coming in are for something other than Royals. Sounds like a name change is inevitable. I guess one could argue that 24% are still saying Royals and that probably dwarfs any other submission besides it, but I don't think that's going to stop the name change.

I guess it also proves that most people aren't tied to the Royals name except for a few die hards. I still maintain the 1999 name change could have worked if they'd come up with something better than Golden Spikes and a catchier uniform. that's going to be the key in all of this.
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2010 :  10:10:24 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm not sure about what that 76% means. I did not submit the Royals because I thought they wanted new names to consider.

I'll vote for the Royals when it comes time. I do like how the Omaha part is not negotiable.

I liked the Golden Spikes name and hats. I liked Spikes even better.

Greg
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nousefouraname
All-Star Mav

2307 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2010 :  12:05:36 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
yeah. I was thinking about it last night and the whole fan submission thing right now isn't a really great indicator of what people really think about the names. like you said, no one is going to submit royals because it's not new and to take it a step further no chance to win the prizes with that name.

I'm torn. I'm kind of all for a new name as long as it's a decent name. I'm not creative enough to come up with anything myself, but I honestly don't see a need to continue to tie them so closely with KC. KC doesn't resonate with people here anymore. the only teams, off the top of my head, whose AAA teams share the parent names are Pawtucket Red Sox, Iowa Cubs, Gwinnett Braves, Omaha Royals, and give a half to Memphis Redbirds. most of those are more iconic than KC.

I think Omaha is a good choice to keep, but if they had to change, how about Nebraska? That could work. Anything with Papillion or Sarpy would be a dud.

Loved the spikes name. would have been perfect combo of railroad tradition and baseball. golden spikes was a train wreck on multiple levels. the uniforms were generic and ugly too. It was a decent start to an idea with horrid execution. no wonder everyone wanted to go back to the royals (even though their uniforms and logos have been lackluster in the last decade as well). The golden spikes fiasco is another warning to this ownership group to do it right or don't do it at all. keep the royals over going to something horrendous or even boring.
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2010 :  12:17:34 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I really liked the Golden Spikes hat. That and the Original O one from years ago were the best of the franchise. I probably liked the Spikes jersey better as well.

Greg
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Greg S
All-Star Mav

4101 Posts

Posted - 08/27/2010 :  12:18:56 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm taking the family and meeting up with a couple others for tonight's game. It will be nice to see Brian Bannister on rehab. Hoping to see Tim Collins pitch as well. Also going to the final game next Thursday. Will be interesting to see how big that crowd gets.

Greg
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